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elisheva_mDisclaimer: I am by no means anything remotely like an expert. I'm just an old woman living in Scotland who loves particular veins of Thai comedy and wants to understand it all better. This isn't even to a rough draft stage, just an on-going attempt to collect and organise thoughts. They will change, this will be updated. Aside from this first time, it won't bother your reading lists. But likewise if anyone here is interested, you'll have to make a point of returning to the post.
I'm rewatching some of my favourites and it will be useful to be able to incorporate them while they are still fresh in my mind. Series and movies which will likely make it in here eventually include: May Who?, The Shipper, Tonhon Chonlatee, I'm Tee Me Too, A Boss and a Babe, UMG, Cause You're My Boy, He's Coming to Me, 1000 Years Old, Ghost Host Ghost House, Low Season, Full House. Possibly Matalada, 55:15, Bad Buddy, The Warp Effect and Duean in FUTS. I hope this list will grow and am always looking for suggestions.
Attempting to find words to talk about Thai comedy and how to usefully distinguish it from western comedies.
Someone on Letterboxd (review for May Who?) described Thai humour as "so goofy it's pure" and that's the best I've come across. Goofy, playful, joyous, exuberant, fun, accepting, unabashed, at least slightly mad, chaotic, madcap, self aware but not self-conscious, with lightness and freedom. Often intelligent writing and clever creativity hidden under seeming nonsense. Nonsense plot lines which actually work because everything is edge of your seat exaggeration anyway, except for the emotions which can be quietly very real. Sometimes exceptionally well-written and well-crafted. Other times it whole-heartedly dives into and embraces wonky production values and plot lines. Both a refusal to take itself seriously and often very serious bits woven in, like the number which include trauma or grief narratives.
And always, always, full of warmth, kindness, generosity, acceptance and love.
Can you tell I adore this way of doing things?
Maybe this will help you understand some of that energy.
(Photosensitivity warning: two instances of mild flashing lights, one near the beginning and the other near the end. It's below my threshold most days but take care if need be.)
Nanon, "Unidentified Wonder", OST for UMG
I've found one person to talk with who even gets what I'm on about and it's a IYKYK kind of thing. We can say like TonChon, like ABAAB but we're still searching for adequate words. There will be things written about this in Thai, but given the state of the internet and my struggles to read Thai (as fond as I am of parts of Thai culture, I do wish they used spaces between words in their sentences) I can't find any. I really want to understand how they see it.
A wee while ago I asked for recs on another platform, gave a similar but shorter list of examples, which were ignored natch, and several words that responders interpreted based on their own western-centric knowledge and experience. It was very much a We're not talking about the same thing experience. It was odd and frustrating, and rather isolating, to be on the receiving end of that. There was no curiosity or questions even.
Meanwhile I also want to share these joyous bonkers life-affirming treasures which are so good for my mental health. But how do I get across that it's different from what others know without it being interpreted as if it were a criticism of what they're doing? Just recommending these or posting about them on social media isn't enough, there is so much competing for limited attention. Everyone who's going to watch something because of my praise has done so already. They're all busy with other things right now, including the one person I have to talk about this with. Just how it goes.
Self-Aware but not Self-Conscious
vs "cringe", a frequent comment on MDL but I'd really like to know how Thais see it. Are many western viewers now conditioned to interpret things as cringe? I'm not a good one to assess this, UK cringe comedy is often quite cruel so maybe I'm just interpreting Thai handling of embarrassing situations as completely opposite because it's not that far?
(Edit: current working understanding is that Thais are perhaps more readily embarassed than I had realised, which will make for greater discomfort when characters are embarrased. A key difference is how often some form of comfort or reassurance is expressed. UK cringe comedy isn't interested in that.)
- everyone will bring their own interpretations of course, but isn't fiction also about learning new ways of seeing and interpreting? -
another "not" to include somewhere, lack of sarcasm (ABAAB has some moments though) and judgementalness
May Who?
Permission to be Imperfect
unpolished as a feature not a bug
emotional arc of the story more important than filling in plot holes
ABAAB
connections with lakorns & how lakorn tropes are used to paper over plot holes because they're not what's important
Permission to be Outrageous or Exaggerated
The Shipper
making a nonsense plot line work
Full House, a very Thai mix of goofy over the top humour and serious emotion made this outlandish plot work
Mixing Comedy and Trauma
I'm Tee, Me Too how bout a light fan service comedy? dai si, but make it about grief...
genre-mixing in general, Thai comedy-horror; Thai supernatural and gentle grief narratives, contrast as a means of heightening emotion
Right now there are significant spoilers in this. Maybe after I write more I'll figure out how to talk about this more abstractly.
The boss is probably depressed too, though it's never said in that way. His therapy turns out to be the cheerfully irrepressible force of nature intern. Who in turn has significant trauma and grief which he isn't dealing with. Instead he makes jokes to hide his own pain. This is shown, not told, through brief changes of facial expression. As they become closer and Gun begins to realise there's a lot going on, Cher doesn't want to talk but asks for and accepts hugs from Gun. And Cher becomes a source of comfort for Gun as well. The causes get less screen time; the focus is always on their care for each other.
The key loss behind Gun's depression is never really dealt with. It's part of the company side of things and all of that is poorly written, more like set and props than a functioning work place. The plot lines behind Cher's trauma and grief are dealt with but only implicitly, blink and you miss it. A few lines of dialogue to suggest what will happen, a short scene and a few more lines to indicate it did. The hows are barely spoken. Boss has lawyers working on it. The possibility that someone will be a witness. Unspoken (in this regard but mentioned elsewhere) is the boss' family's money and influence and how that makes things happen.
All of this could have been Big Drama and milked for the tension, but here, the focus is kept on the main characters' relationship, work place and friend group. The emotional arc of the story is more important than filling in those gaps.
For those who are used to other ways of telling stories, these things probably feel unfinished. But they're not. They're just not the focus here.
Centering everything in a cheerfully irrepressible force of nature who never shuts up and would rather make jokes than talk about his pain but takes care of and is taken care of by his friends and faen is how this series incorporates a very real and significant trauma and grief narrative without letting it weigh down the comedy.
(Make a Wish would fit in here too but I don't remember it well enough and am maybe not keen on rewatching it.)
paraphrasing L - in western drama, when there's trauma it's dark and trauma is the focus. but in this style of Thai comedy, the tone is kept light and trauma informs the story without weighing it down
(this difference is probably key to how much misunderstanding there is with many of these series by western viewers)
I've thought of a contrast to include but it's full of nots and that doesn't feel right to put near the accepting positives above. Yay for Thai comedy and its effects on me. But noting here so I don't forget: What it doesn't have is (I've forgotten the word I thought of), cynicism, or trying to be cool. A character who is will probably poke himself in the eye with his sunglasses and then we'll find out he's a lovable dork who's maybe a bit lonely, na.
.
I'm rewatching some of my favourites and it will be useful to be able to incorporate them while they are still fresh in my mind. Series and movies which will likely make it in here eventually include: May Who?, The Shipper, Tonhon Chonlatee, I'm Tee Me Too, A Boss and a Babe, UMG, Cause You're My Boy, He's Coming to Me, 1000 Years Old, Ghost Host Ghost House, Low Season, Full House. Possibly Matalada, 55:15, Bad Buddy, The Warp Effect and Duean in FUTS. I hope this list will grow and am always looking for suggestions.
Attempting to find words to talk about Thai comedy and how to usefully distinguish it from western comedies.
Someone on Letterboxd (review for May Who?) described Thai humour as "so goofy it's pure" and that's the best I've come across. Goofy, playful, joyous, exuberant, fun, accepting, unabashed, at least slightly mad, chaotic, madcap, self aware but not self-conscious, with lightness and freedom. Often intelligent writing and clever creativity hidden under seeming nonsense. Nonsense plot lines which actually work because everything is edge of your seat exaggeration anyway, except for the emotions which can be quietly very real. Sometimes exceptionally well-written and well-crafted. Other times it whole-heartedly dives into and embraces wonky production values and plot lines. Both a refusal to take itself seriously and often very serious bits woven in, like the number which include trauma or grief narratives.
And always, always, full of warmth, kindness, generosity, acceptance and love.
Can you tell I adore this way of doing things?
Maybe this will help you understand some of that energy.
(Photosensitivity warning: two instances of mild flashing lights, one near the beginning and the other near the end. It's below my threshold most days but take care if need be.)
Nanon, "Unidentified Wonder", OST for UMG
I've found one person to talk with who even gets what I'm on about and it's a IYKYK kind of thing. We can say like TonChon, like ABAAB but we're still searching for adequate words. There will be things written about this in Thai, but given the state of the internet and my struggles to read Thai (as fond as I am of parts of Thai culture, I do wish they used spaces between words in their sentences) I can't find any. I really want to understand how they see it.
A wee while ago I asked for recs on another platform, gave a similar but shorter list of examples, which were ignored natch, and several words that responders interpreted based on their own western-centric knowledge and experience. It was very much a We're not talking about the same thing experience. It was odd and frustrating, and rather isolating, to be on the receiving end of that. There was no curiosity or questions even.
Meanwhile I also want to share these joyous bonkers life-affirming treasures which are so good for my mental health. But how do I get across that it's different from what others know without it being interpreted as if it were a criticism of what they're doing? Just recommending these or posting about them on social media isn't enough, there is so much competing for limited attention. Everyone who's going to watch something because of my praise has done so already. They're all busy with other things right now, including the one person I have to talk about this with. Just how it goes.
Self-Aware but not Self-Conscious
vs "cringe", a frequent comment on MDL but I'd really like to know how Thais see it. Are many western viewers now conditioned to interpret things as cringe? I'm not a good one to assess this, UK cringe comedy is often quite cruel so maybe I'm just interpreting Thai handling of embarrassing situations as completely opposite because it's not that far?
(Edit: current working understanding is that Thais are perhaps more readily embarassed than I had realised, which will make for greater discomfort when characters are embarrased. A key difference is how often some form of comfort or reassurance is expressed. UK cringe comedy isn't interested in that.)
- everyone will bring their own interpretations of course, but isn't fiction also about learning new ways of seeing and interpreting? -
another "not" to include somewhere, lack of sarcasm (ABAAB has some moments though) and judgementalness
May Who?
Permission to be Imperfect
unpolished as a feature not a bug
emotional arc of the story more important than filling in plot holes
ABAAB
connections with lakorns & how lakorn tropes are used to paper over plot holes because they're not what's important
Permission to be Outrageous or Exaggerated
The Shipper
making a nonsense plot line work
Full House, a very Thai mix of goofy over the top humour and serious emotion made this outlandish plot work
Mixing Comedy and Trauma
I'm Tee, Me Too how bout a light fan service comedy? dai si, but make it about grief...
genre-mixing in general, Thai comedy-horror; Thai supernatural and gentle grief narratives, contrast as a means of heightening emotion
Right now there are significant spoilers in this. Maybe after I write more I'll figure out how to talk about this more abstractly.
ABAAB
There are better comedies. The writing is uneven, sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not. It looks like an office romance but subverts the boss-intern dynamic by making the intern a cheerfully irrepressible force of nature who has less than zero interest in an office job. A significant supporting character takes medication for depression and goes to therapy. It's not a side plot, just one of many things going on.The boss is probably depressed too, though it's never said in that way. His therapy turns out to be the cheerfully irrepressible force of nature intern. Who in turn has significant trauma and grief which he isn't dealing with. Instead he makes jokes to hide his own pain. This is shown, not told, through brief changes of facial expression. As they become closer and Gun begins to realise there's a lot going on, Cher doesn't want to talk but asks for and accepts hugs from Gun. And Cher becomes a source of comfort for Gun as well. The causes get less screen time; the focus is always on their care for each other.
The key loss behind Gun's depression is never really dealt with. It's part of the company side of things and all of that is poorly written, more like set and props than a functioning work place. The plot lines behind Cher's trauma and grief are dealt with but only implicitly, blink and you miss it. A few lines of dialogue to suggest what will happen, a short scene and a few more lines to indicate it did. The hows are barely spoken. Boss has lawyers working on it. The possibility that someone will be a witness. Unspoken (in this regard but mentioned elsewhere) is the boss' family's money and influence and how that makes things happen.
All of this could have been Big Drama and milked for the tension, but here, the focus is kept on the main characters' relationship, work place and friend group. The emotional arc of the story is more important than filling in those gaps.
For those who are used to other ways of telling stories, these things probably feel unfinished. But they're not. They're just not the focus here.
Centering everything in a cheerfully irrepressible force of nature who never shuts up and would rather make jokes than talk about his pain but takes care of and is taken care of by his friends and faen is how this series incorporates a very real and significant trauma and grief narrative without letting it weigh down the comedy.
(Make a Wish would fit in here too but I don't remember it well enough and am maybe not keen on rewatching it.)
paraphrasing L - in western drama, when there's trauma it's dark and trauma is the focus. but in this style of Thai comedy, the tone is kept light and trauma informs the story without weighing it down
(this difference is probably key to how much misunderstanding there is with many of these series by western viewers)
I've thought of a contrast to include but it's full of nots and that doesn't feel right to put near the accepting positives above. Yay for Thai comedy and its effects on me. But noting here so I don't forget: What it doesn't have is (I've forgotten the word I thought of), cynicism, or trying to be cool. A character who is will probably poke himself in the eye with his sunglasses and then we'll find out he's a lovable dork who's maybe a bit lonely, na.
.
